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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Citation Plagiarism&#8221;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/</link>
	<description>Culture, Politics, Academia and Other Shiny Objects</description>
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		<title>By: stuartbuck@msn.com</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3668</link>
		<dc:creator>stuartbuck@msn.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jun 2007 16:49:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3668</guid>
		<description>My take, &lt;a href=&quot;http://stuartbuck.blogspot.com/2006/05/plagiarism.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;from a year ago&lt;/a&gt;.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My take, <a href="http://stuartbuck.blogspot.com/2006/05/plagiarism.html" rel="nofollow">from a year ago</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3665</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jun 2007 10:24:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3665</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s bound to be a happy medium (or perhaps happy media) that those of us here (lurking and otherwise) can push toward. As gatekeepers, maybe do less of the enforcing that Tim writes about above. &lt;i&gt;Imagined Communities&lt;/i&gt; doesn&#039;t need to be cited anymore unless it&#039;s being quoted directly. If an author has somehow gotten through to publication without having read it, that will be readily apparent. Anderson is surely an extreme case, but in general, I suspect that Tim is right and less genuflection would be better.

There are  similar questions in my field, journalism and business writing, with added challenges of compression, readability and the presumption of writing for a general rather than specialist audience.

What I tend to read is on the rigorous end of popular history, so theoretical disputes and footnotes as signals are less common here (assumptions tend to be more embedded), but when the authors cite archives, I tend to presume that they have done the spadework themselves. Sometimes that&#039;s a problem in and of itself: One of the areas I&#039;m interested in is Central and Eastern Europe, where some post-Soviet archives that were open in the early and mid-90s are now closed. At some point you either trust the author or you don&#039;t, and all the rest of the appartus is just there to enable the trust.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s bound to be a happy medium (or perhaps happy media) that those of us here (lurking and otherwise) can push toward. As gatekeepers, maybe do less of the enforcing that Tim writes about above. <i>Imagined Communities</i> doesn&#8217;t need to be cited anymore unless it&#8217;s being quoted directly. If an author has somehow gotten through to publication without having read it, that will be readily apparent. Anderson is surely an extreme case, but in general, I suspect that Tim is right and less genuflection would be better.</p>
<p>There are  similar questions in my field, journalism and business writing, with added challenges of compression, readability and the presumption of writing for a general rather than specialist audience.</p>
<p>What I tend to read is on the rigorous end of popular history, so theoretical disputes and footnotes as signals are less common here (assumptions tend to be more embedded), but when the authors cite archives, I tend to presume that they have done the spadework themselves. Sometimes that&#8217;s a problem in and of itself: One of the areas I&#8217;m interested in is Central and Eastern Europe, where some post-Soviet archives that were open in the early and mid-90s are now closed. At some point you either trust the author or you don&#8217;t, and all the rest of the appartus is just there to enable the trust.</p>
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		<title>By: jpool</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3660</link>
		<dc:creator>jpool</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 20:51:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3660</guid>
		<description>I especially like the phrase, &quot;Of course, if [citation without explanation] were a crime the anthropology job market would be much better than it is.&quot;
I once read a footnote in a colleague&#039;s dissertation in which she identified a body of texts that she had found general inspiration in while writing her diss, without ever identifying what theoretical or methodological relationship they bore to her actual work.  There may have been connections there that I didn&#039;t see and she didn&#039;t explain, but it felt to me like citing the music that one enjoyed listening to while writing.
I think the type of text also makes a difference.  I find that I appreciate the bibliographic footnotes in monographs (as tools for the reader, rather than as displays of competence), whereas I feel like they weigh down journal articles (though I know that when I try to publish one I will feel/be compelled to include them).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I especially like the phrase, &#8220;Of course, if [citation without explanation] were a crime the anthropology job market would be much better than it is.&#8221;<br />
I once read a footnote in a colleague&#8217;s dissertation in which she identified a body of texts that she had found general inspiration in while writing her diss, without ever identifying what theoretical or methodological relationship they bore to her actual work.  There may have been connections there that I didn&#8217;t see and she didn&#8217;t explain, but it felt to me like citing the music that one enjoyed listening to while writing.<br />
I think the type of text also makes a difference.  I find that I appreciate the bibliographic footnotes in monographs (as tools for the reader, rather than as displays of competence), whereas I feel like they weigh down journal articles (though I know that when I try to publish one I will feel/be compelled to include them).</p>
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		<title>By: Gavin Weaire</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3659</link>
		<dc:creator>Gavin Weaire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:29:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3659</guid>
		<description>Looking at the comment thread more carefully, I see that my point had already been made, more efficiently.  Post in  haste, regret at leisure.*


*Not original.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looking at the comment thread more carefully, I see that my point had already been made, more efficiently.  Post in  haste, regret at leisure.*</p>
<p>*Not original.</p>
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		<title>By: Gavin Weaire</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3658</link>
		<dc:creator>Gavin Weaire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:17:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3658</guid>
		<description>You read about an article in a footnote while browsing the recent acquisitions.  It&#039;s not something that&#039;s directly relevant to what you&#039;re working on right now, but it sounds interesting, so you decide to spend half-an-hour with it as a break.  Refreshes you effectively, you get back to your work. 

You chat about it a bit with colleagues, it feeds into some offhand remarks in your teaching, you meet the author at a conference and tell them how much you liked it.  But you don&#039;t do anything with the article, really, just file it away in the back of your mind.

Ten years later, you&#039;ve moved on, you&#039;re working in a new area, and it occurs to you that the article offers a nice parallel to what you&#039;re doing now.   A bit out of left field, has never been cited in this context before, but you can see a connection.

Are you really obligated to keep track of where you originally saw the article cited?  That&#039;s silly.    

  What if you saw it cited in multiple places, and it was the fact that it was so broadly influential that led one to read it?  Would one want to cite a review, or all the reviews, that led one to decide to read a book?   

  It might work for a discipline that consisted entirely of highly specialized problems with hermetically sealed, linearly chronological, histories, in which everything relevant was always cited and each discussion was always in direct response to the immediately previous discussion.  No notion of broad professional competence within the field.  Is there such a discipline?   Would anyone want to work in it?

  On the other hand, I&#039;d think that it was a matter of basic intellectual honesty not to cite something that one knew only indirectly without clarifying that one hadn&#039;t read it for oneself.   Same as if one uses a translation without being competent in the original language.  It puts a limit on the level of trust that a reader should have.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You read about an article in a footnote while browsing the recent acquisitions.  It&#8217;s not something that&#8217;s directly relevant to what you&#8217;re working on right now, but it sounds interesting, so you decide to spend half-an-hour with it as a break.  Refreshes you effectively, you get back to your work. </p>
<p>You chat about it a bit with colleagues, it feeds into some offhand remarks in your teaching, you meet the author at a conference and tell them how much you liked it.  But you don&#8217;t do anything with the article, really, just file it away in the back of your mind.</p>
<p>Ten years later, you&#8217;ve moved on, you&#8217;re working in a new area, and it occurs to you that the article offers a nice parallel to what you&#8217;re doing now.   A bit out of left field, has never been cited in this context before, but you can see a connection.</p>
<p>Are you really obligated to keep track of where you originally saw the article cited?  That&#8217;s silly.    </p>
<p>  What if you saw it cited in multiple places, and it was the fact that it was so broadly influential that led one to read it?  Would one want to cite a review, or all the reviews, that led one to decide to read a book?   </p>
<p>  It might work for a discipline that consisted entirely of highly specialized problems with hermetically sealed, linearly chronological, histories, in which everything relevant was always cited and each discussion was always in direct response to the immediately previous discussion.  No notion of broad professional competence within the field.  Is there such a discipline?   Would anyone want to work in it?</p>
<p>  On the other hand, I&#8217;d think that it was a matter of basic intellectual honesty not to cite something that one knew only indirectly without clarifying that one hadn&#8217;t read it for oneself.   Same as if one uses a translation without being competent in the original language.  It puts a limit on the level of trust that a reader should have.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Burke</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3657</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Burke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:25:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3657</guid>
		<description>Well, and some of that is not necessarily a felt need, but an enforced one--the comment you&#039;re most likely to get as a grad student about your dissertation, or as a junior person trying to publish an article, is that what you&#039;re writing needs more citations to more things. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, and some of that is not necessarily a felt need, but an enforced one&#8211;the comment you&#8217;re most likely to get as a grad student about your dissertation, or as a junior person trying to publish an article, is that what you&#8217;re writing needs more citations to more things.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3656</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 09:26:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3656</guid>
		<description>Is the effect of the extra footnoting to allow someone to place a paper within a debate in the field? That is, could one scan the footnotes and figure out, ok, broadly aligned with idea such-and-such -- if so, it might serve as signposting. Some portion of the intended audience would then note its place in the debate without necessarily reading the whole thing. That might be useful in some contexts. (I do something similar at times with political texts from unfamiliar authors.)

I also wonder if &quot;scholars ... hav[ing] enough confidence to make those arguments without the safety net of invoking legitimating theorists or disciplinary canons&quot; is simply a function of age and experience within a discipline. I can see people who feel professionally insecure feeling a need to cite, and thus borrow, extra authority. I would imagine that this perceived need recedes with time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is the effect of the extra footnoting to allow someone to place a paper within a debate in the field? That is, could one scan the footnotes and figure out, ok, broadly aligned with idea such-and-such &#8212; if so, it might serve as signposting. Some portion of the intended audience would then note its place in the debate without necessarily reading the whole thing. That might be useful in some contexts. (I do something similar at times with political texts from unfamiliar authors.)</p>
<p>I also wonder if &#8220;scholars &#8230; hav[ing] enough confidence to make those arguments without the safety net of invoking legitimating theorists or disciplinary canons&#8221; is simply a function of age and experience within a discipline. I can see people who feel professionally insecure feeling a need to cite, and thus borrow, extra authority. I would imagine that this perceived need recedes with time.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Dresner</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3655</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Dresner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 02:34:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3655</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;densely choked with footnotes&lt;/i&gt;

Most of the time I find material insufficiently footnoted, not overly. I do wish people wouldn&#039;t use footnotes as a substitute for a bibliography, though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>densely choked with footnotes</i></p>
<p>Most of the time I find material insufficiently footnoted, not overly. I do wish people wouldn&#8217;t use footnotes as a substitute for a bibliography, though.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Burke</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3654</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Burke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 18:51:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3654</guid>
		<description>Right. I mean, part of the point of a citation is to draw the attention of readers who are sufficiently interested in the argument to check the citation. Once you&#039;ve read the original, I don&#039;t think you have to reproduce in your own text a comprehensive tale of the exact way in which you encountered all the sources you cite. 

On appearing to do work that one has not done, it seems to me that there is a difference between the work process of academia (studying, reading, thinking) and the work product of academia (published words). Copying published words steals labor twice over; pretending to have done work processes that one has not but producing useful knowledge nevertheless is a different kind of offense. 
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right. I mean, part of the point of a citation is to draw the attention of readers who are sufficiently interested in the argument to check the citation. Once you&#8217;ve read the original, I don&#8217;t think you have to reproduce in your own text a comprehensive tale of the exact way in which you encountered all the sources you cite. </p>
<p>On appearing to do work that one has not done, it seems to me that there is a difference between the work process of academia (studying, reading, thinking) and the work product of academia (published words). Copying published words steals labor twice over; pretending to have done work processes that one has not but producing useful knowledge nevertheless is a different kind of offense.</p>
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		<title>By: dnexon</title>
		<link>http://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/2007/06/18/citation-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3653</link>
		<dc:creator>dnexon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 17:57:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=382#comment-3653</guid>
		<description>I would draw the line at the scenario you describe. If one has read the source, then one doesn&#039;t need to cite an earlier stage of the chain. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would draw the line at the scenario you describe. If one has read the source, then one doesn&#8217;t need to cite an earlier stage of the chain.</p>
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